Date   

Re: FYI: TOC Election (Jan 2019)

Quinton Hoole
 

Thanks Chris

I don’t think that there’s particular urgency in manually stitching together git commits, but more importantly, according to the Charter:

18. Amendments

This charter may be amended by a two-thirds vote (excluding abstentions) of all Governing Board members.

So presumably the number of changes to the Charter over time has therefore been very small, and each one is accompanied by a vote by the GB, of which we should have a written record.

In the absence of a proper change log, could we at least in the mean time publish a list of all changes that were voted on by the GB, and any additional changes that were not voted on.

Thanks

Q

From: Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...>
Date: Thursday, November 1, 2018 at 13:52
To: Quinton Hoole <quinton.hoole@...>
Cc: Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...>, Brian Grant <briangrant@...>, CNCF TOC <cncf-toc@...>, Mike Dolan <mdolan@...>
Subject: Re: [cncf-toc] FYI: TOC Election (Jan 2019)

I get your point, historically it's been a word doc because that's how lawyers love to craft these things initially.

We put the charter now on GitHub as the canonical source: https://github.com/cncf/foundation/blob/master/charter.md

I'll have my team go stitch together git commits representing the changes over time in GitHub, but will take a bit of time.

On Thu, Nov 1, 2018 at 3:07 PM Quinton Hoole <quinton.hoole@...> wrote:
I think it’s important that we have a public record of historical changes to the charter (like the one you made below, but I’m sure there are others that came before it).

Could you make that historical record available somewhere?  For the future, GitHub seems like a fine plan, as you say.

Q

From: <cncf-toc@...> on behalf of Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...>
Date: Thursday, November 1, 2018 at 12:56
To: Quinton Hoole <quinton.hoole@...>
Cc: Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...>, Brian Grant <briangrant@...>, CNCF TOC <cncf-toc@...>, Mike Dolan <mdolan@...>
Subject: Re: [cncf-toc] FYI: TOC Election (Jan 2019)

It's updated on the website now but lives in a word doc.

We are moving the charter to GitHub to make our lives easier and that will be the canonical source moving forward.

On Thu, Nov 1, 2018 at 2:51 PM Quinton Hoole <quinton.hoole@...> wrote:
Thanks Chris

Where is the canonical version of the charter, and it’s change history?  Is it in GitHub somewhere? I can’t seem to find it.

Thanks

Q

From: <cncf-toc@...> on behalf of Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...>
Date: Thursday, November 1, 2018 at 08:53
To: Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...>
Cc: Brian Grant <briangrant@...>, CNCF TOC <cncf-toc@...>, Michael Dolan <mdolan@...>
Subject: Re: [cncf-toc] FYI: TOC Election (Jan 2019)


Chris,

Thanks for the quick resolution, and for communicating it to promptly to CNCF members!

         - Bryan


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 6:17 PM Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...> wrote:

Bryan, you’re correct that three years ago all CNCF members participated in the nomination process. Reviewing the meeting minutes, I found the resolution that changed the nomination language. It was never updated in the public version of the charter on the website. I apologize for the error and have fixed this now on the website adding the resolution change to Section 6(e)(ii):

“Nominations: Each CNCF member may nominate up to two (2) technical representatives, (from vendors, end users or any other fields), at most one of which may be from their respective company. The nominee(s) must agree to participate prior to being added to the nomination list.”

We have opened up the nomination process to all CNCF members now and have modified the schedule accordingly to still allow one month of nominations for all members:

Oct 26th: Nominations Open
Nov 30th: Nominations Close
Dec 1st: Qualification Period Opens
Dec 14th: Qualification Period Closes (end of KubeCon Seattle)
Dec 17th: Election Opens
Jan 22nd: Election Closes
Jan 29th: Election Results Posted


Thanks, I've updated things here also: https://github.com/cncf/toc/blob/master/process/election-schedule.md


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 8:10 PM Brian Grant <briangrant@...> wrote:
There are some more details here, such as which TOC members were elected by which group:


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 4:42 PM Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...> wrote:

I don't think that that's correct -- or rather, I don't see any grammatical way that "each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate..." can possibly refer to 6(e)(i), which describes the composition of the TOC.  If that's the intent, 6(e)(ii) would read: "each individual (entity or member) eligible to elect a TOC member may nominate..." (emphasis mine).  Again, I believe that our intent when developing the charter was that any member of the CNCF regardless of level would be able to at least nominate members for the TOC.  Moreover, when I look back at the nominations from three years ago, I see nominations from CNCF members from all levels (that is, regardless of membership level) -- and I can't find any document that indicates that the nomination process for that first election would have different nomination entity eligibility than our process now. 

So it is my belief that all CNCF members can participate in nominations -- not merely those who are on the governing board.  Mike, could you weigh in here?  This is highly relevant as it affects our current nomination process.

         - Bryan


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 4:17 PM Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...> wrote:
Totally agree that it's a bit confusing at first, but on the nomination point:

"Each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate" refers to the previous clause which says "The TOC shall be composed of nine (9) TOC members: six (6) elected by the Governing Board, one (1) selected by the End User TAB and two (2) elected by the initial seven TOC members."

So, for the election of the 6 GB-appointed TOC members, each person on the GB may nominate up to two people, with at most one from their company, and then vote.

For the election for the end user-appointed TOC member, each company in the end user community can nominate and vote.

And then when the TOC has an election to reappoint or replace Quinton in March, the 7 non-TOC-appointed members of the TOC (meaning everyone but Quinton and Brian) will do the nominating and voting. We updated https://github.com/cncf/toc/blob/master/process/election-schedule.md to state whether they were GB-appointed, TOC-appointed, or end user-appointed: https://github.com/cncf/toc/commit/c46b1afb333f80fbf1b8e153cb207d069162511c

Hope this helps.


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 5:37 PM Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...> wrote:

Chris,

I'm a little confused about the nomination process. In particular, I can't see where in the charter it describes who many nominate candidates for the TOC. In section 6(e)(ii) it says:

Each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate up to two (2) technical representatives, (from vendors, end users or any other fields), at most one of which may be from their respective company. The nominee(s) must agree to participate prior to being added to the nomination list.

But I cannot see where in the doc it is actually defines who is eligible to nominate a TOC member.  (Our implementation is that it is voting members of the governing board who are permitted to nominate, but why wouldn't the charter say that if that's the intent?)  I am trying to recall our chartering discussions, and I seem to recall that one of the advantages of any level of membership was that a member could nominate for the TOC; is that incorrect?  If so, would you mind pointing me to the document that defines the nomination process?

Somewhat similarly: I think it will also be helpful to get clarity about the origins of each member, to clearly delineate the 6 GB-determined members from the 2 TOC-determined members from the 1 end user-determined member.  Which is really a polite way of me saying that between the initial TOC conditions, the resignations, etc., I have lost track of who's who. ;)

          - Bryan


On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 2:32 PM Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...> wrote:
TOC nominations are starting TODAY for the 6 TOC slots that open up in Jan 2019 that are selected by GB members (they can propose UP TO TWO NOMINEES as part of the GB, where you can only nominate up to one candidate from your organization, the other candidate has to be outside your organization): https://github.com/cncf/toc/blob/master/process/election-schedule.md

The seats that open up are:

Jonathan Boulle (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Bryan Cantrill (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Camille Fournier (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Benjamin Hindman (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Ken Owens (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Alexis Richardson (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)

Here's the timeline for the election, we are giving ample time due to the holidays:

Oct 26th: Nominations Open (TODAY)
Nov 26th: Nominations Close
Nov 27th: Qualification Period Opens
Dec 14th: Qualification Period Closes (end of KubeCon Seattle)
Dec 17th: Election Opens
Jan 22nd: Election Closes
Jan 29th: Election Results Posted!

In summary, these nominations are for the 6 slots nominated by the CNCF Governing Board (GB) members. You have to be a CNCF GB member in order to nominate someone. Each CNCF GB member CAN NOMINATION ONLY TWO PEOPLE MAXIMUM, where only one of them can come from your company (the other candidate can come from anywhere). See CNCF Charter Section 6(e) for full election process details: https://www.cncf.io/about/charter

We will also discuss this at the next TOC meeting on Nov 6th regarding the process if the community has any questions.

Thanks!

--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719



--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


Re: FYI: TOC Election (Jan 2019)

Chris Aniszczyk
 

I get your point, historically it's been a word doc because that's how lawyers love to craft these things initially.

We put the charter now on GitHub as the canonical source: https://github.com/cncf/foundation/blob/master/charter.md

I'll have my team go stitch together git commits representing the changes over time in GitHub, but will take a bit of time.


On Thu, Nov 1, 2018 at 3:07 PM Quinton Hoole <quinton.hoole@...> wrote:
I think it’s important that we have a public record of historical changes to the charter (like the one you made below, but I’m sure there are others that came before it).

Could you make that historical record available somewhere?  For the future, GitHub seems like a fine plan, as you say.

Q

From: <cncf-toc@...> on behalf of Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...>
Date: Thursday, November 1, 2018 at 12:56
To: Quinton Hoole <quinton.hoole@...>
Cc: Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...>, Brian Grant <briangrant@...>, CNCF TOC <cncf-toc@...>, Mike Dolan <mdolan@...>
Subject: Re: [cncf-toc] FYI: TOC Election (Jan 2019)

It's updated on the website now but lives in a word doc.

We are moving the charter to GitHub to make our lives easier and that will be the canonical source moving forward.

On Thu, Nov 1, 2018 at 2:51 PM Quinton Hoole <quinton.hoole@...> wrote:
Thanks Chris

Where is the canonical version of the charter, and it’s change history?  Is it in GitHub somewhere? I can’t seem to find it.

Thanks

Q

From: <cncf-toc@...> on behalf of Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...>
Date: Thursday, November 1, 2018 at 08:53
To: Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...>
Cc: Brian Grant <briangrant@...>, CNCF TOC <cncf-toc@...>, Michael Dolan <mdolan@...>
Subject: Re: [cncf-toc] FYI: TOC Election (Jan 2019)


Chris,

Thanks for the quick resolution, and for communicating it to promptly to CNCF members!

         - Bryan


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 6:17 PM Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...> wrote:

Bryan, you’re correct that three years ago all CNCF members participated in the nomination process. Reviewing the meeting minutes, I found the resolution that changed the nomination language. It was never updated in the public version of the charter on the website. I apologize for the error and have fixed this now on the website adding the resolution change to Section 6(e)(ii):

“Nominations: Each CNCF member may nominate up to two (2) technical representatives, (from vendors, end users or any other fields), at most one of which may be from their respective company. The nominee(s) must agree to participate prior to being added to the nomination list.”

We have opened up the nomination process to all CNCF members now and have modified the schedule accordingly to still allow one month of nominations for all members:

Oct 26th: Nominations Open
Nov 30th: Nominations Close
Dec 1st: Qualification Period Opens
Dec 14th: Qualification Period Closes (end of KubeCon Seattle)
Dec 17th: Election Opens
Jan 22nd: Election Closes
Jan 29th: Election Results Posted


Thanks, I've updated things here also: https://github.com/cncf/toc/blob/master/process/election-schedule.md


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 8:10 PM Brian Grant <briangrant@...> wrote:
There are some more details here, such as which TOC members were elected by which group:


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 4:42 PM Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...> wrote:

I don't think that that's correct -- or rather, I don't see any grammatical way that "each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate..." can possibly refer to 6(e)(i), which describes the composition of the TOC.  If that's the intent, 6(e)(ii) would read: "each individual (entity or member) eligible to elect a TOC member may nominate..." (emphasis mine).  Again, I believe that our intent when developing the charter was that any member of the CNCF regardless of level would be able to at least nominate members for the TOC.  Moreover, when I look back at the nominations from three years ago, I see nominations from CNCF members from all levels (that is, regardless of membership level) -- and I can't find any document that indicates that the nomination process for that first election would have different nomination entity eligibility than our process now. 

So it is my belief that all CNCF members can participate in nominations -- not merely those who are on the governing board.  Mike, could you weigh in here?  This is highly relevant as it affects our current nomination process.

         - Bryan


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 4:17 PM Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...> wrote:
Totally agree that it's a bit confusing at first, but on the nomination point:

"Each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate" refers to the previous clause which says "The TOC shall be composed of nine (9) TOC members: six (6) elected by the Governing Board, one (1) selected by the End User TAB and two (2) elected by the initial seven TOC members."

So, for the election of the 6 GB-appointed TOC members, each person on the GB may nominate up to two people, with at most one from their company, and then vote.

For the election for the end user-appointed TOC member, each company in the end user community can nominate and vote.

And then when the TOC has an election to reappoint or replace Quinton in March, the 7 non-TOC-appointed members of the TOC (meaning everyone but Quinton and Brian) will do the nominating and voting. We updated https://github.com/cncf/toc/blob/master/process/election-schedule.md to state whether they were GB-appointed, TOC-appointed, or end user-appointed: https://github.com/cncf/toc/commit/c46b1afb333f80fbf1b8e153cb207d069162511c

Hope this helps.


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 5:37 PM Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...> wrote:

Chris,

I'm a little confused about the nomination process. In particular, I can't see where in the charter it describes who many nominate candidates for the TOC. In section 6(e)(ii) it says:

Each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate up to two (2) technical representatives, (from vendors, end users or any other fields), at most one of which may be from their respective company. The nominee(s) must agree to participate prior to being added to the nomination list.

But I cannot see where in the doc it is actually defines who is eligible to nominate a TOC member.  (Our implementation is that it is voting members of the governing board who are permitted to nominate, but why wouldn't the charter say that if that's the intent?)  I am trying to recall our chartering discussions, and I seem to recall that one of the advantages of any level of membership was that a member could nominate for the TOC; is that incorrect?  If so, would you mind pointing me to the document that defines the nomination process?

Somewhat similarly: I think it will also be helpful to get clarity about the origins of each member, to clearly delineate the 6 GB-determined members from the 2 TOC-determined members from the 1 end user-determined member.  Which is really a polite way of me saying that between the initial TOC conditions, the resignations, etc., I have lost track of who's who. ;)

          - Bryan


On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 2:32 PM Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...> wrote:
TOC nominations are starting TODAY for the 6 TOC slots that open up in Jan 2019 that are selected by GB members (they can propose UP TO TWO NOMINEES as part of the GB, where you can only nominate up to one candidate from your organization, the other candidate has to be outside your organization): https://github.com/cncf/toc/blob/master/process/election-schedule.md

The seats that open up are:

Jonathan Boulle (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Bryan Cantrill (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Camille Fournier (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Benjamin Hindman (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Ken Owens (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Alexis Richardson (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)

Here's the timeline for the election, we are giving ample time due to the holidays:

Oct 26th: Nominations Open (TODAY)
Nov 26th: Nominations Close
Nov 27th: Qualification Period Opens
Dec 14th: Qualification Period Closes (end of KubeCon Seattle)
Dec 17th: Election Opens
Jan 22nd: Election Closes
Jan 29th: Election Results Posted!

In summary, these nominations are for the 6 slots nominated by the CNCF Governing Board (GB) members. You have to be a CNCF GB member in order to nominate someone. Each CNCF GB member CAN NOMINATION ONLY TWO PEOPLE MAXIMUM, where only one of them can come from your company (the other candidate can come from anywhere). See CNCF Charter Section 6(e) for full election process details: https://www.cncf.io/about/charter

We will also discuss this at the next TOC meeting on Nov 6th regarding the process if the community has any questions.

Thanks!

--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719



--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


Re: FYI: TOC Election (Jan 2019)

Quinton Hoole
 

I think it’s important that we have a public record of historical changes to the charter (like the one you made below, but I’m sure there are others that came before it).

Could you make that historical record available somewhere?  For the future, GitHub seems like a fine plan, as you say.

Q

From: <cncf-toc@...> on behalf of Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...>
Date: Thursday, November 1, 2018 at 12:56
To: Quinton Hoole <quinton.hoole@...>
Cc: Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...>, Brian Grant <briangrant@...>, CNCF TOC <cncf-toc@...>, Mike Dolan <mdolan@...>
Subject: Re: [cncf-toc] FYI: TOC Election (Jan 2019)

It's updated on the website now but lives in a word doc.

We are moving the charter to GitHub to make our lives easier and that will be the canonical source moving forward.

On Thu, Nov 1, 2018 at 2:51 PM Quinton Hoole <quinton.hoole@...> wrote:
Thanks Chris

Where is the canonical version of the charter, and it’s change history?  Is it in GitHub somewhere? I can’t seem to find it.

Thanks

Q

From: <cncf-toc@...> on behalf of Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...>
Date: Thursday, November 1, 2018 at 08:53
To: Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...>
Cc: Brian Grant <briangrant@...>, CNCF TOC <cncf-toc@...>, Michael Dolan <mdolan@...>
Subject: Re: [cncf-toc] FYI: TOC Election (Jan 2019)


Chris,

Thanks for the quick resolution, and for communicating it to promptly to CNCF members!

         - Bryan


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 6:17 PM Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...> wrote:

Bryan, you’re correct that three years ago all CNCF members participated in the nomination process. Reviewing the meeting minutes, I found the resolution that changed the nomination language. It was never updated in the public version of the charter on the website. I apologize for the error and have fixed this now on the website adding the resolution change to Section 6(e)(ii):

“Nominations: Each CNCF member may nominate up to two (2) technical representatives, (from vendors, end users or any other fields), at most one of which may be from their respective company. The nominee(s) must agree to participate prior to being added to the nomination list.”

We have opened up the nomination process to all CNCF members now and have modified the schedule accordingly to still allow one month of nominations for all members:

Oct 26th: Nominations Open
Nov 30th: Nominations Close
Dec 1st: Qualification Period Opens
Dec 14th: Qualification Period Closes (end of KubeCon Seattle)
Dec 17th: Election Opens
Jan 22nd: Election Closes
Jan 29th: Election Results Posted


Thanks, I've updated things here also: https://github.com/cncf/toc/blob/master/process/election-schedule.md


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 8:10 PM Brian Grant <briangrant@...> wrote:
There are some more details here, such as which TOC members were elected by which group:


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 4:42 PM Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...> wrote:

I don't think that that's correct -- or rather, I don't see any grammatical way that "each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate..." can possibly refer to 6(e)(i), which describes the composition of the TOC.  If that's the intent, 6(e)(ii) would read: "each individual (entity or member) eligible to elect a TOC member may nominate..." (emphasis mine).  Again, I believe that our intent when developing the charter was that any member of the CNCF regardless of level would be able to at least nominate members for the TOC.  Moreover, when I look back at the nominations from three years ago, I see nominations from CNCF members from all levels (that is, regardless of membership level) -- and I can't find any document that indicates that the nomination process for that first election would have different nomination entity eligibility than our process now. 

So it is my belief that all CNCF members can participate in nominations -- not merely those who are on the governing board.  Mike, could you weigh in here?  This is highly relevant as it affects our current nomination process.

         - Bryan


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 4:17 PM Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...> wrote:
Totally agree that it's a bit confusing at first, but on the nomination point:

"Each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate" refers to the previous clause which says "The TOC shall be composed of nine (9) TOC members: six (6) elected by the Governing Board, one (1) selected by the End User TAB and two (2) elected by the initial seven TOC members."

So, for the election of the 6 GB-appointed TOC members, each person on the GB may nominate up to two people, with at most one from their company, and then vote.

For the election for the end user-appointed TOC member, each company in the end user community can nominate and vote.

And then when the TOC has an election to reappoint or replace Quinton in March, the 7 non-TOC-appointed members of the TOC (meaning everyone but Quinton and Brian) will do the nominating and voting. We updated https://github.com/cncf/toc/blob/master/process/election-schedule.md to state whether they were GB-appointed, TOC-appointed, or end user-appointed: https://github.com/cncf/toc/commit/c46b1afb333f80fbf1b8e153cb207d069162511c

Hope this helps.


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 5:37 PM Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...> wrote:

Chris,

I'm a little confused about the nomination process. In particular, I can't see where in the charter it describes who many nominate candidates for the TOC. In section 6(e)(ii) it says:

Each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate up to two (2) technical representatives, (from vendors, end users or any other fields), at most one of which may be from their respective company. The nominee(s) must agree to participate prior to being added to the nomination list.

But I cannot see where in the doc it is actually defines who is eligible to nominate a TOC member.  (Our implementation is that it is voting members of the governing board who are permitted to nominate, but why wouldn't the charter say that if that's the intent?)  I am trying to recall our chartering discussions, and I seem to recall that one of the advantages of any level of membership was that a member could nominate for the TOC; is that incorrect?  If so, would you mind pointing me to the document that defines the nomination process?

Somewhat similarly: I think it will also be helpful to get clarity about the origins of each member, to clearly delineate the 6 GB-determined members from the 2 TOC-determined members from the 1 end user-determined member.  Which is really a polite way of me saying that between the initial TOC conditions, the resignations, etc., I have lost track of who's who. ;)

          - Bryan


On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 2:32 PM Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...> wrote:
TOC nominations are starting TODAY for the 6 TOC slots that open up in Jan 2019 that are selected by GB members (they can propose UP TO TWO NOMINEES as part of the GB, where you can only nominate up to one candidate from your organization, the other candidate has to be outside your organization): https://github.com/cncf/toc/blob/master/process/election-schedule.md

The seats that open up are:

Jonathan Boulle (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Bryan Cantrill (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Camille Fournier (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Benjamin Hindman (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Ken Owens (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Alexis Richardson (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)

Here's the timeline for the election, we are giving ample time due to the holidays:

Oct 26th: Nominations Open (TODAY)
Nov 26th: Nominations Close
Nov 27th: Qualification Period Opens
Dec 14th: Qualification Period Closes (end of KubeCon Seattle)
Dec 17th: Election Opens
Jan 22nd: Election Closes
Jan 29th: Election Results Posted!

In summary, these nominations are for the 6 slots nominated by the CNCF Governing Board (GB) members. You have to be a CNCF GB member in order to nominate someone. Each CNCF GB member CAN NOMINATION ONLY TWO PEOPLE MAXIMUM, where only one of them can come from your company (the other candidate can come from anywhere). See CNCF Charter Section 6(e) for full election process details: https://www.cncf.io/about/charter

We will also discuss this at the next TOC meeting on Nov 6th regarding the process if the community has any questions.

Thanks!

--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719



--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


Re: FYI: TOC Election (Jan 2019)

Chris Aniszczyk
 

It's updated on the website now but lives in a word doc.

We are moving the charter to GitHub to make our lives easier and that will be the canonical source moving forward.

On Thu, Nov 1, 2018 at 2:51 PM Quinton Hoole <quinton.hoole@...> wrote:
Thanks Chris

Where is the canonical version of the charter, and it’s change history?  Is it in GitHub somewhere? I can’t seem to find it.

Thanks

Q

From: <cncf-toc@...> on behalf of Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...>
Date: Thursday, November 1, 2018 at 08:53
To: Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...>
Cc: Brian Grant <briangrant@...>, CNCF TOC <cncf-toc@...>, Michael Dolan <mdolan@...>
Subject: Re: [cncf-toc] FYI: TOC Election (Jan 2019)


Chris,

Thanks for the quick resolution, and for communicating it to promptly to CNCF members!

         - Bryan


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 6:17 PM Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...> wrote:

Bryan, you’re correct that three years ago all CNCF members participated in the nomination process. Reviewing the meeting minutes, I found the resolution that changed the nomination language. It was never updated in the public version of the charter on the website. I apologize for the error and have fixed this now on the website adding the resolution change to Section 6(e)(ii):

“Nominations: Each CNCF member may nominate up to two (2) technical representatives, (from vendors, end users or any other fields), at most one of which may be from their respective company. The nominee(s) must agree to participate prior to being added to the nomination list.”

We have opened up the nomination process to all CNCF members now and have modified the schedule accordingly to still allow one month of nominations for all members:

Oct 26th: Nominations Open
Nov 30th: Nominations Close
Dec 1st: Qualification Period Opens
Dec 14th: Qualification Period Closes (end of KubeCon Seattle)
Dec 17th: Election Opens
Jan 22nd: Election Closes
Jan 29th: Election Results Posted


Thanks, I've updated things here also: https://github.com/cncf/toc/blob/master/process/election-schedule.md


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 8:10 PM Brian Grant <briangrant@...> wrote:
There are some more details here, such as which TOC members were elected by which group:


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 4:42 PM Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...> wrote:

I don't think that that's correct -- or rather, I don't see any grammatical way that "each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate..." can possibly refer to 6(e)(i), which describes the composition of the TOC.  If that's the intent, 6(e)(ii) would read: "each individual (entity or member) eligible to elect a TOC member may nominate..." (emphasis mine).  Again, I believe that our intent when developing the charter was that any member of the CNCF regardless of level would be able to at least nominate members for the TOC.  Moreover, when I look back at the nominations from three years ago, I see nominations from CNCF members from all levels (that is, regardless of membership level) -- and I can't find any document that indicates that the nomination process for that first election would have different nomination entity eligibility than our process now. 

So it is my belief that all CNCF members can participate in nominations -- not merely those who are on the governing board.  Mike, could you weigh in here?  This is highly relevant as it affects our current nomination process.

         - Bryan


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 4:17 PM Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...> wrote:
Totally agree that it's a bit confusing at first, but on the nomination point:

"Each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate" refers to the previous clause which says "The TOC shall be composed of nine (9) TOC members: six (6) elected by the Governing Board, one (1) selected by the End User TAB and two (2) elected by the initial seven TOC members."

So, for the election of the 6 GB-appointed TOC members, each person on the GB may nominate up to two people, with at most one from their company, and then vote.

For the election for the end user-appointed TOC member, each company in the end user community can nominate and vote.

And then when the TOC has an election to reappoint or replace Quinton in March, the 7 non-TOC-appointed members of the TOC (meaning everyone but Quinton and Brian) will do the nominating and voting. We updated https://github.com/cncf/toc/blob/master/process/election-schedule.md to state whether they were GB-appointed, TOC-appointed, or end user-appointed: https://github.com/cncf/toc/commit/c46b1afb333f80fbf1b8e153cb207d069162511c

Hope this helps.


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 5:37 PM Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...> wrote:

Chris,

I'm a little confused about the nomination process. In particular, I can't see where in the charter it describes who many nominate candidates for the TOC. In section 6(e)(ii) it says:

Each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate up to two (2) technical representatives, (from vendors, end users or any other fields), at most one of which may be from their respective company. The nominee(s) must agree to participate prior to being added to the nomination list.

But I cannot see where in the doc it is actually defines who is eligible to nominate a TOC member.  (Our implementation is that it is voting members of the governing board who are permitted to nominate, but why wouldn't the charter say that if that's the intent?)  I am trying to recall our chartering discussions, and I seem to recall that one of the advantages of any level of membership was that a member could nominate for the TOC; is that incorrect?  If so, would you mind pointing me to the document that defines the nomination process?

Somewhat similarly: I think it will also be helpful to get clarity about the origins of each member, to clearly delineate the 6 GB-determined members from the 2 TOC-determined members from the 1 end user-determined member.  Which is really a polite way of me saying that between the initial TOC conditions, the resignations, etc., I have lost track of who's who. ;)

          - Bryan


On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 2:32 PM Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...> wrote:
TOC nominations are starting TODAY for the 6 TOC slots that open up in Jan 2019 that are selected by GB members (they can propose UP TO TWO NOMINEES as part of the GB, where you can only nominate up to one candidate from your organization, the other candidate has to be outside your organization): https://github.com/cncf/toc/blob/master/process/election-schedule.md

The seats that open up are:

Jonathan Boulle (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Bryan Cantrill (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Camille Fournier (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Benjamin Hindman (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Ken Owens (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Alexis Richardson (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)

Here's the timeline for the election, we are giving ample time due to the holidays:

Oct 26th: Nominations Open (TODAY)
Nov 26th: Nominations Close
Nov 27th: Qualification Period Opens
Dec 14th: Qualification Period Closes (end of KubeCon Seattle)
Dec 17th: Election Opens
Jan 22nd: Election Closes
Jan 29th: Election Results Posted!

In summary, these nominations are for the 6 slots nominated by the CNCF Governing Board (GB) members. You have to be a CNCF GB member in order to nominate someone. Each CNCF GB member CAN NOMINATION ONLY TWO PEOPLE MAXIMUM, where only one of them can come from your company (the other candidate can come from anywhere). See CNCF Charter Section 6(e) for full election process details: https://www.cncf.io/about/charter

We will also discuss this at the next TOC meeting on Nov 6th regarding the process if the community has any questions.

Thanks!

--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719



--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


Re: FYI: TOC Election (Jan 2019)

Quinton Hoole
 

Thanks Chris

Where is the canonical version of the charter, and it’s change history?  Is it in GitHub somewhere? I can’t seem to find it.

Thanks

Q

From: <cncf-toc@...> on behalf of Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...>
Date: Thursday, November 1, 2018 at 08:53
To: Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...>
Cc: Brian Grant <briangrant@...>, CNCF TOC <cncf-toc@...>, Michael Dolan <mdolan@...>
Subject: Re: [cncf-toc] FYI: TOC Election (Jan 2019)


Chris,

Thanks for the quick resolution, and for communicating it to promptly to CNCF members!

         - Bryan


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 6:17 PM Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...> wrote:

Bryan, you’re correct that three years ago all CNCF members participated in the nomination process. Reviewing the meeting minutes, I found the resolution that changed the nomination language. It was never updated in the public version of the charter on the website. I apologize for the error and have fixed this now on the website adding the resolution change to Section 6(e)(ii):

“Nominations: Each CNCF member may nominate up to two (2) technical representatives, (from vendors, end users or any other fields), at most one of which may be from their respective company. The nominee(s) must agree to participate prior to being added to the nomination list.”

We have opened up the nomination process to all CNCF members now and have modified the schedule accordingly to still allow one month of nominations for all members:

Oct 26th: Nominations Open
Nov 30th: Nominations Close
Dec 1st: Qualification Period Opens
Dec 14th: Qualification Period Closes (end of KubeCon Seattle)
Dec 17th: Election Opens
Jan 22nd: Election Closes
Jan 29th: Election Results Posted


Thanks, I've updated things here also: https://github.com/cncf/toc/blob/master/process/election-schedule.md


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 8:10 PM Brian Grant <briangrant@...> wrote:
There are some more details here, such as which TOC members were elected by which group:


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 4:42 PM Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...> wrote:

I don't think that that's correct -- or rather, I don't see any grammatical way that "each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate..." can possibly refer to 6(e)(i), which describes the composition of the TOC.  If that's the intent, 6(e)(ii) would read: "each individual (entity or member) eligible to elect a TOC member may nominate..." (emphasis mine).  Again, I believe that our intent when developing the charter was that any member of the CNCF regardless of level would be able to at least nominate members for the TOC.  Moreover, when I look back at the nominations from three years ago, I see nominations from CNCF members from all levels (that is, regardless of membership level) -- and I can't find any document that indicates that the nomination process for that first election would have different nomination entity eligibility than our process now. 

So it is my belief that all CNCF members can participate in nominations -- not merely those who are on the governing board.  Mike, could you weigh in here?  This is highly relevant as it affects our current nomination process.

         - Bryan


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 4:17 PM Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...> wrote:
Totally agree that it's a bit confusing at first, but on the nomination point:

"Each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate" refers to the previous clause which says "The TOC shall be composed of nine (9) TOC members: six (6) elected by the Governing Board, one (1) selected by the End User TAB and two (2) elected by the initial seven TOC members."

So, for the election of the 6 GB-appointed TOC members, each person on the GB may nominate up to two people, with at most one from their company, and then vote.

For the election for the end user-appointed TOC member, each company in the end user community can nominate and vote.

And then when the TOC has an election to reappoint or replace Quinton in March, the 7 non-TOC-appointed members of the TOC (meaning everyone but Quinton and Brian) will do the nominating and voting. We updated https://github.com/cncf/toc/blob/master/process/election-schedule.md to state whether they were GB-appointed, TOC-appointed, or end user-appointed: https://github.com/cncf/toc/commit/c46b1afb333f80fbf1b8e153cb207d069162511c

Hope this helps.


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 5:37 PM Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...> wrote:

Chris,

I'm a little confused about the nomination process. In particular, I can't see where in the charter it describes who many nominate candidates for the TOC. In section 6(e)(ii) it says:

Each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate up to two (2) technical representatives, (from vendors, end users or any other fields), at most one of which may be from their respective company. The nominee(s) must agree to participate prior to being added to the nomination list.

But I cannot see where in the doc it is actually defines who is eligible to nominate a TOC member.  (Our implementation is that it is voting members of the governing board who are permitted to nominate, but why wouldn't the charter say that if that's the intent?)  I am trying to recall our chartering discussions, and I seem to recall that one of the advantages of any level of membership was that a member could nominate for the TOC; is that incorrect?  If so, would you mind pointing me to the document that defines the nomination process?

Somewhat similarly: I think it will also be helpful to get clarity about the origins of each member, to clearly delineate the 6 GB-determined members from the 2 TOC-determined members from the 1 end user-determined member.  Which is really a polite way of me saying that between the initial TOC conditions, the resignations, etc., I have lost track of who's who. ;)

          - Bryan


On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 2:32 PM Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...> wrote:
TOC nominations are starting TODAY for the 6 TOC slots that open up in Jan 2019 that are selected by GB members (they can propose UP TO TWO NOMINEES as part of the GB, where you can only nominate up to one candidate from your organization, the other candidate has to be outside your organization): https://github.com/cncf/toc/blob/master/process/election-schedule.md

The seats that open up are:

Jonathan Boulle (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Bryan Cantrill (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Camille Fournier (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Benjamin Hindman (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Ken Owens (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Alexis Richardson (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)

Here's the timeline for the election, we are giving ample time due to the holidays:

Oct 26th: Nominations Open (TODAY)
Nov 26th: Nominations Close
Nov 27th: Qualification Period Opens
Dec 14th: Qualification Period Closes (end of KubeCon Seattle)
Dec 17th: Election Opens
Jan 22nd: Election Closes
Jan 29th: Election Results Posted!

In summary, these nominations are for the 6 slots nominated by the CNCF Governing Board (GB) members. You have to be a CNCF GB member in order to nominate someone. Each CNCF GB member CAN NOMINATION ONLY TWO PEOPLE MAXIMUM, where only one of them can come from your company (the other candidate can come from anywhere). See CNCF Charter Section 6(e) for full election process details: https://www.cncf.io/about/charter

We will also discuss this at the next TOC meeting on Nov 6th regarding the process if the community has any questions.

Thanks!

--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719



--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


Re: FYI: TOC Election (Jan 2019)

Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...>
 


Chris,

Thanks for the quick resolution, and for communicating it to promptly to CNCF members!

         - Bryan


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 6:17 PM Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...> wrote:

Bryan, you’re correct that three years ago all CNCF members participated in the nomination process. Reviewing the meeting minutes, I found the resolution that changed the nomination language. It was never updated in the public version of the charter on the website. I apologize for the error and have fixed this now on the website adding the resolution change to Section 6(e)(ii):

“Nominations: Each CNCF member may nominate up to two (2) technical representatives, (from vendors, end users or any other fields), at most one of which may be from their respective company. The nominee(s) must agree to participate prior to being added to the nomination list.”

We have opened up the nomination process to all CNCF members now and have modified the schedule accordingly to still allow one month of nominations for all members:

Oct 26th: Nominations Open
Nov 30th: Nominations Close
Dec 1st: Qualification Period Opens
Dec 14th: Qualification Period Closes (end of KubeCon Seattle)
Dec 17th: Election Opens
Jan 22nd: Election Closes
Jan 29th: Election Results Posted


Thanks, I've updated things here also: https://github.com/cncf/toc/blob/master/process/election-schedule.md


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 8:10 PM Brian Grant <briangrant@...> wrote:
There are some more details here, such as which TOC members were elected by which group:


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 4:42 PM Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...> wrote:

I don't think that that's correct -- or rather, I don't see any grammatical way that "each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate..." can possibly refer to 6(e)(i), which describes the composition of the TOC.  If that's the intent, 6(e)(ii) would read: "each individual (entity or member) eligible to elect a TOC member may nominate..." (emphasis mine).  Again, I believe that our intent when developing the charter was that any member of the CNCF regardless of level would be able to at least nominate members for the TOC.  Moreover, when I look back at the nominations from three years ago, I see nominations from CNCF members from all levels (that is, regardless of membership level) -- and I can't find any document that indicates that the nomination process for that first election would have different nomination entity eligibility than our process now. 

So it is my belief that all CNCF members can participate in nominations -- not merely those who are on the governing board.  Mike, could you weigh in here?  This is highly relevant as it affects our current nomination process.

         - Bryan


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 4:17 PM Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...> wrote:
Totally agree that it's a bit confusing at first, but on the nomination point:

"Each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate" refers to the previous clause which says "The TOC shall be composed of nine (9) TOC members: six (6) elected by the Governing Board, one (1) selected by the End User TAB and two (2) elected by the initial seven TOC members."

So, for the election of the 6 GB-appointed TOC members, each person on the GB may nominate up to two people, with at most one from their company, and then vote.

For the election for the end user-appointed TOC member, each company in the end user community can nominate and vote.

And then when the TOC has an election to reappoint or replace Quinton in March, the 7 non-TOC-appointed members of the TOC (meaning everyone but Quinton and Brian) will do the nominating and voting. We updated https://github.com/cncf/toc/blob/master/process/election-schedule.md to state whether they were GB-appointed, TOC-appointed, or end user-appointed: https://github.com/cncf/toc/commit/c46b1afb333f80fbf1b8e153cb207d069162511c

Hope this helps.


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 5:37 PM Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...> wrote:

Chris,

I'm a little confused about the nomination process. In particular, I can't see where in the charter it describes who many nominate candidates for the TOC. In section 6(e)(ii) it says:

Each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate up to two (2) technical representatives, (from vendors, end users or any other fields), at most one of which may be from their respective company. The nominee(s) must agree to participate prior to being added to the nomination list.

But I cannot see where in the doc it is actually defines who is eligible to nominate a TOC member.  (Our implementation is that it is voting members of the governing board who are permitted to nominate, but why wouldn't the charter say that if that's the intent?)  I am trying to recall our chartering discussions, and I seem to recall that one of the advantages of any level of membership was that a member could nominate for the TOC; is that incorrect?  If so, would you mind pointing me to the document that defines the nomination process?

Somewhat similarly: I think it will also be helpful to get clarity about the origins of each member, to clearly delineate the 6 GB-determined members from the 2 TOC-determined members from the 1 end user-determined member.  Which is really a polite way of me saying that between the initial TOC conditions, the resignations, etc., I have lost track of who's who. ;)

          - Bryan


On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 2:32 PM Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...> wrote:
TOC nominations are starting TODAY for the 6 TOC slots that open up in Jan 2019 that are selected by GB members (they can propose UP TO TWO NOMINEES as part of the GB, where you can only nominate up to one candidate from your organization, the other candidate has to be outside your organization): https://github.com/cncf/toc/blob/master/process/election-schedule.md

The seats that open up are:

Jonathan Boulle (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Bryan Cantrill (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Camille Fournier (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Benjamin Hindman (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Ken Owens (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Alexis Richardson (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)

Here's the timeline for the election, we are giving ample time due to the holidays:

Oct 26th: Nominations Open (TODAY)
Nov 26th: Nominations Close
Nov 27th: Qualification Period Opens
Dec 14th: Qualification Period Closes (end of KubeCon Seattle)
Dec 17th: Election Opens
Jan 22nd: Election Closes
Jan 29th: Election Results Posted!

In summary, these nominations are for the 6 slots nominated by the CNCF Governing Board (GB) members. You have to be a CNCF GB member in order to nominate someone. Each CNCF GB member CAN NOMINATION ONLY TWO PEOPLE MAXIMUM, where only one of them can come from your company (the other candidate can come from anywhere). See CNCF Charter Section 6(e) for full election process details: https://www.cncf.io/about/charter

We will also discuss this at the next TOC meeting on Nov 6th regarding the process if the community has any questions.

Thanks!

--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719



--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


Re: FYI: TOC Election (Jan 2019)

Chris Aniszczyk
 

Bryan, you’re correct that three years ago all CNCF members participated in the nomination process. Reviewing the meeting minutes, I found the resolution that changed the nomination language. It was never updated in the public version of the charter on the website. I apologize for the error and have fixed this now on the website adding the resolution change to Section 6(e)(ii):

“Nominations: Each CNCF member may nominate up to two (2) technical representatives, (from vendors, end users or any other fields), at most one of which may be from their respective company. The nominee(s) must agree to participate prior to being added to the nomination list.”

We have opened up the nomination process to all CNCF members now and have modified the schedule accordingly to still allow one month of nominations for all members:

Oct 26th: Nominations Open
Nov 30th: Nominations Close
Dec 1st: Qualification Period Opens
Dec 14th: Qualification Period Closes (end of KubeCon Seattle)
Dec 17th: Election Opens
Jan 22nd: Election Closes
Jan 29th: Election Results Posted


Thanks, I've updated things here also: https://github.com/cncf/toc/blob/master/process/election-schedule.md


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 8:10 PM Brian Grant <briangrant@...> wrote:
There are some more details here, such as which TOC members were elected by which group:


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 4:42 PM Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...> wrote:

I don't think that that's correct -- or rather, I don't see any grammatical way that "each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate..." can possibly refer to 6(e)(i), which describes the composition of the TOC.  If that's the intent, 6(e)(ii) would read: "each individual (entity or member) eligible to elect a TOC member may nominate..." (emphasis mine).  Again, I believe that our intent when developing the charter was that any member of the CNCF regardless of level would be able to at least nominate members for the TOC.  Moreover, when I look back at the nominations from three years ago, I see nominations from CNCF members from all levels (that is, regardless of membership level) -- and I can't find any document that indicates that the nomination process for that first election would have different nomination entity eligibility than our process now. 

So it is my belief that all CNCF members can participate in nominations -- not merely those who are on the governing board.  Mike, could you weigh in here?  This is highly relevant as it affects our current nomination process.

         - Bryan


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 4:17 PM Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...> wrote:
Totally agree that it's a bit confusing at first, but on the nomination point:

"Each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate" refers to the previous clause which says "The TOC shall be composed of nine (9) TOC members: six (6) elected by the Governing Board, one (1) selected by the End User TAB and two (2) elected by the initial seven TOC members."

So, for the election of the 6 GB-appointed TOC members, each person on the GB may nominate up to two people, with at most one from their company, and then vote.

For the election for the end user-appointed TOC member, each company in the end user community can nominate and vote.

And then when the TOC has an election to reappoint or replace Quinton in March, the 7 non-TOC-appointed members of the TOC (meaning everyone but Quinton and Brian) will do the nominating and voting. We updated https://github.com/cncf/toc/blob/master/process/election-schedule.md to state whether they were GB-appointed, TOC-appointed, or end user-appointed: https://github.com/cncf/toc/commit/c46b1afb333f80fbf1b8e153cb207d069162511c

Hope this helps.


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 5:37 PM Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...> wrote:

Chris,

I'm a little confused about the nomination process. In particular, I can't see where in the charter it describes who many nominate candidates for the TOC. In section 6(e)(ii) it says:

Each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate up to two (2) technical representatives, (from vendors, end users or any other fields), at most one of which may be from their respective company. The nominee(s) must agree to participate prior to being added to the nomination list.

But I cannot see where in the doc it is actually defines who is eligible to nominate a TOC member.  (Our implementation is that it is voting members of the governing board who are permitted to nominate, but why wouldn't the charter say that if that's the intent?)  I am trying to recall our chartering discussions, and I seem to recall that one of the advantages of any level of membership was that a member could nominate for the TOC; is that incorrect?  If so, would you mind pointing me to the document that defines the nomination process?

Somewhat similarly: I think it will also be helpful to get clarity about the origins of each member, to clearly delineate the 6 GB-determined members from the 2 TOC-determined members from the 1 end user-determined member.  Which is really a polite way of me saying that between the initial TOC conditions, the resignations, etc., I have lost track of who's who. ;)

          - Bryan


On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 2:32 PM Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...> wrote:
TOC nominations are starting TODAY for the 6 TOC slots that open up in Jan 2019 that are selected by GB members (they can propose UP TO TWO NOMINEES as part of the GB, where you can only nominate up to one candidate from your organization, the other candidate has to be outside your organization): https://github.com/cncf/toc/blob/master/process/election-schedule.md

The seats that open up are:

Jonathan Boulle (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Bryan Cantrill (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Camille Fournier (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Benjamin Hindman (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Ken Owens (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Alexis Richardson (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)

Here's the timeline for the election, we are giving ample time due to the holidays:

Oct 26th: Nominations Open (TODAY)
Nov 26th: Nominations Close
Nov 27th: Qualification Period Opens
Dec 14th: Qualification Period Closes (end of KubeCon Seattle)
Dec 17th: Election Opens
Jan 22nd: Election Closes
Jan 29th: Election Results Posted!

In summary, these nominations are for the 6 slots nominated by the CNCF Governing Board (GB) members. You have to be a CNCF GB member in order to nominate someone. Each CNCF GB member CAN NOMINATION ONLY TWO PEOPLE MAXIMUM, where only one of them can come from your company (the other candidate can come from anywhere). See CNCF Charter Section 6(e) for full election process details: https://www.cncf.io/about/charter

We will also discuss this at the next TOC meeting on Nov 6th regarding the process if the community has any questions.

Thanks!

--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719



--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


Re: FYI: TOC Election (Jan 2019)

Brian Grant
 

There are some more details here, such as which TOC members were elected by which group:


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 4:42 PM Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...> wrote:

I don't think that that's correct -- or rather, I don't see any grammatical way that "each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate..." can possibly refer to 6(e)(i), which describes the composition of the TOC.  If that's the intent, 6(e)(ii) would read: "each individual (entity or member) eligible to elect a TOC member may nominate..." (emphasis mine).  Again, I believe that our intent when developing the charter was that any member of the CNCF regardless of level would be able to at least nominate members for the TOC.  Moreover, when I look back at the nominations from three years ago, I see nominations from CNCF members from all levels (that is, regardless of membership level) -- and I can't find any document that indicates that the nomination process for that first election would have different nomination entity eligibility than our process now. 

So it is my belief that all CNCF members can participate in nominations -- not merely those who are on the governing board.  Mike, could you weigh in here?  This is highly relevant as it affects our current nomination process.

         - Bryan


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 4:17 PM Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...> wrote:
Totally agree that it's a bit confusing at first, but on the nomination point:

"Each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate" refers to the previous clause which says "The TOC shall be composed of nine (9) TOC members: six (6) elected by the Governing Board, one (1) selected by the End User TAB and two (2) elected by the initial seven TOC members."

So, for the election of the 6 GB-appointed TOC members, each person on the GB may nominate up to two people, with at most one from their company, and then vote.

For the election for the end user-appointed TOC member, each company in the end user community can nominate and vote.

And then when the TOC has an election to reappoint or replace Quinton in March, the 7 non-TOC-appointed members of the TOC (meaning everyone but Quinton and Brian) will do the nominating and voting. We updated https://github.com/cncf/toc/blob/master/process/election-schedule.md to state whether they were GB-appointed, TOC-appointed, or end user-appointed: https://github.com/cncf/toc/commit/c46b1afb333f80fbf1b8e153cb207d069162511c

Hope this helps.


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 5:37 PM Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...> wrote:

Chris,

I'm a little confused about the nomination process. In particular, I can't see where in the charter it describes who many nominate candidates for the TOC. In section 6(e)(ii) it says:

Each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate up to two (2) technical representatives, (from vendors, end users or any other fields), at most one of which may be from their respective company. The nominee(s) must agree to participate prior to being added to the nomination list.

But I cannot see where in the doc it is actually defines who is eligible to nominate a TOC member.  (Our implementation is that it is voting members of the governing board who are permitted to nominate, but why wouldn't the charter say that if that's the intent?)  I am trying to recall our chartering discussions, and I seem to recall that one of the advantages of any level of membership was that a member could nominate for the TOC; is that incorrect?  If so, would you mind pointing me to the document that defines the nomination process?

Somewhat similarly: I think it will also be helpful to get clarity about the origins of each member, to clearly delineate the 6 GB-determined members from the 2 TOC-determined members from the 1 end user-determined member.  Which is really a polite way of me saying that between the initial TOC conditions, the resignations, etc., I have lost track of who's who. ;)

          - Bryan


On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 2:32 PM Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...> wrote:
TOC nominations are starting TODAY for the 6 TOC slots that open up in Jan 2019 that are selected by GB members (they can propose UP TO TWO NOMINEES as part of the GB, where you can only nominate up to one candidate from your organization, the other candidate has to be outside your organization): https://github.com/cncf/toc/blob/master/process/election-schedule.md

The seats that open up are:

Jonathan Boulle (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Bryan Cantrill (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Camille Fournier (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Benjamin Hindman (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Ken Owens (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Alexis Richardson (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)

Here's the timeline for the election, we are giving ample time due to the holidays:

Oct 26th: Nominations Open (TODAY)
Nov 26th: Nominations Close
Nov 27th: Qualification Period Opens
Dec 14th: Qualification Period Closes (end of KubeCon Seattle)
Dec 17th: Election Opens
Jan 22nd: Election Closes
Jan 29th: Election Results Posted!

In summary, these nominations are for the 6 slots nominated by the CNCF Governing Board (GB) members. You have to be a CNCF GB member in order to nominate someone. Each CNCF GB member CAN NOMINATION ONLY TWO PEOPLE MAXIMUM, where only one of them can come from your company (the other candidate can come from anywhere). See CNCF Charter Section 6(e) for full election process details: https://www.cncf.io/about/charter

We will also discuss this at the next TOC meeting on Nov 6th regarding the process if the community has any questions.

Thanks!

--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


Re: FYI: TOC Election (Jan 2019)

Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...>
 


I don't think that that's correct -- or rather, I don't see any grammatical way that "each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate..." can possibly refer to 6(e)(i), which describes the composition of the TOC.  If that's the intent, 6(e)(ii) would read: "each individual (entity or member) eligible to elect a TOC member may nominate..." (emphasis mine).  Again, I believe that our intent when developing the charter was that any member of the CNCF regardless of level would be able to at least nominate members for the TOC.  Moreover, when I look back at the nominations from three years ago, I see nominations from CNCF members from all levels (that is, regardless of membership level) -- and I can't find any document that indicates that the nomination process for that first election would have different nomination entity eligibility than our process now. 

So it is my belief that all CNCF members can participate in nominations -- not merely those who are on the governing board.  Mike, could you weigh in here?  This is highly relevant as it affects our current nomination process.

         - Bryan


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 4:17 PM Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...> wrote:
Totally agree that it's a bit confusing at first, but on the nomination point:

"Each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate" refers to the previous clause which says "The TOC shall be composed of nine (9) TOC members: six (6) elected by the Governing Board, one (1) selected by the End User TAB and two (2) elected by the initial seven TOC members."

So, for the election of the 6 GB-appointed TOC members, each person on the GB may nominate up to two people, with at most one from their company, and then vote.

For the election for the end user-appointed TOC member, each company in the end user community can nominate and vote.

And then when the TOC has an election to reappoint or replace Quinton in March, the 7 non-TOC-appointed members of the TOC (meaning everyone but Quinton and Brian) will do the nominating and voting. We updated https://github.com/cncf/toc/blob/master/process/election-schedule.md to state whether they were GB-appointed, TOC-appointed, or end user-appointed: https://github.com/cncf/toc/commit/c46b1afb333f80fbf1b8e153cb207d069162511c

Hope this helps.


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 5:37 PM Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...> wrote:

Chris,

I'm a little confused about the nomination process. In particular, I can't see where in the charter it describes who many nominate candidates for the TOC. In section 6(e)(ii) it says:

Each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate up to two (2) technical representatives, (from vendors, end users or any other fields), at most one of which may be from their respective company. The nominee(s) must agree to participate prior to being added to the nomination list.

But I cannot see where in the doc it is actually defines who is eligible to nominate a TOC member.  (Our implementation is that it is voting members of the governing board who are permitted to nominate, but why wouldn't the charter say that if that's the intent?)  I am trying to recall our chartering discussions, and I seem to recall that one of the advantages of any level of membership was that a member could nominate for the TOC; is that incorrect?  If so, would you mind pointing me to the document that defines the nomination process?

Somewhat similarly: I think it will also be helpful to get clarity about the origins of each member, to clearly delineate the 6 GB-determined members from the 2 TOC-determined members from the 1 end user-determined member.  Which is really a polite way of me saying that between the initial TOC conditions, the resignations, etc., I have lost track of who's who. ;)

          - Bryan


On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 2:32 PM Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...> wrote:
TOC nominations are starting TODAY for the 6 TOC slots that open up in Jan 2019 that are selected by GB members (they can propose UP TO TWO NOMINEES as part of the GB, where you can only nominate up to one candidate from your organization, the other candidate has to be outside your organization): https://github.com/cncf/toc/blob/master/process/election-schedule.md

The seats that open up are:

Jonathan Boulle (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Bryan Cantrill (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Camille Fournier (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Benjamin Hindman (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Ken Owens (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Alexis Richardson (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)

Here's the timeline for the election, we are giving ample time due to the holidays:

Oct 26th: Nominations Open (TODAY)
Nov 26th: Nominations Close
Nov 27th: Qualification Period Opens
Dec 14th: Qualification Period Closes (end of KubeCon Seattle)
Dec 17th: Election Opens
Jan 22nd: Election Closes
Jan 29th: Election Results Posted!

In summary, these nominations are for the 6 slots nominated by the CNCF Governing Board (GB) members. You have to be a CNCF GB member in order to nominate someone. Each CNCF GB member CAN NOMINATION ONLY TWO PEOPLE MAXIMUM, where only one of them can come from your company (the other candidate can come from anywhere). See CNCF Charter Section 6(e) for full election process details: https://www.cncf.io/about/charter

We will also discuss this at the next TOC meeting on Nov 6th regarding the process if the community has any questions.

Thanks!

--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719



--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


Re: FYI: TOC Election (Jan 2019)

Chris Aniszczyk
 

Totally agree that it's a bit confusing at first, but on the nomination point:

"Each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate" refers to the previous clause which says "The TOC shall be composed of nine (9) TOC members: six (6) elected by the Governing Board, one (1) selected by the End User TAB and two (2) elected by the initial seven TOC members."

So, for the election of the 6 GB-appointed TOC members, each person on the GB may nominate up to two people, with at most one from their company, and then vote.

For the election for the end user-appointed TOC member, each company in the end user community can nominate and vote.

And then when the TOC has an election to reappoint or replace Quinton in March, the 7 non-TOC-appointed members of the TOC (meaning everyone but Quinton and Brian) will do the nominating and voting. We updated https://github.com/cncf/toc/blob/master/process/election-schedule.md to state whether they were GB-appointed, TOC-appointed, or end user-appointed: https://github.com/cncf/toc/commit/c46b1afb333f80fbf1b8e153cb207d069162511c

Hope this helps.


On Wed, Oct 31, 2018 at 5:37 PM Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...> wrote:

Chris,

I'm a little confused about the nomination process. In particular, I can't see where in the charter it describes who many nominate candidates for the TOC. In section 6(e)(ii) it says:

Each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate up to two (2) technical representatives, (from vendors, end users or any other fields), at most one of which may be from their respective company. The nominee(s) must agree to participate prior to being added to the nomination list.

But I cannot see where in the doc it is actually defines who is eligible to nominate a TOC member.  (Our implementation is that it is voting members of the governing board who are permitted to nominate, but why wouldn't the charter say that if that's the intent?)  I am trying to recall our chartering discussions, and I seem to recall that one of the advantages of any level of membership was that a member could nominate for the TOC; is that incorrect?  If so, would you mind pointing me to the document that defines the nomination process?

Somewhat similarly: I think it will also be helpful to get clarity about the origins of each member, to clearly delineate the 6 GB-determined members from the 2 TOC-determined members from the 1 end user-determined member.  Which is really a polite way of me saying that between the initial TOC conditions, the resignations, etc., I have lost track of who's who. ;)

          - Bryan


On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 2:32 PM Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...> wrote:
TOC nominations are starting TODAY for the 6 TOC slots that open up in Jan 2019 that are selected by GB members (they can propose UP TO TWO NOMINEES as part of the GB, where you can only nominate up to one candidate from your organization, the other candidate has to be outside your organization): https://github.com/cncf/toc/blob/master/process/election-schedule.md

The seats that open up are:

Jonathan Boulle (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Bryan Cantrill (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Camille Fournier (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Benjamin Hindman (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Ken Owens (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Alexis Richardson (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)

Here's the timeline for the election, we are giving ample time due to the holidays:

Oct 26th: Nominations Open (TODAY)
Nov 26th: Nominations Close
Nov 27th: Qualification Period Opens
Dec 14th: Qualification Period Closes (end of KubeCon Seattle)
Dec 17th: Election Opens
Jan 22nd: Election Closes
Jan 29th: Election Results Posted!

In summary, these nominations are for the 6 slots nominated by the CNCF Governing Board (GB) members. You have to be a CNCF GB member in order to nominate someone. Each CNCF GB member CAN NOMINATION ONLY TWO PEOPLE MAXIMUM, where only one of them can come from your company (the other candidate can come from anywhere). See CNCF Charter Section 6(e) for full election process details: https://www.cncf.io/about/charter

We will also discuss this at the next TOC meeting on Nov 6th regarding the process if the community has any questions.

Thanks!

--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719



--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


Re: FYI: TOC Election (Jan 2019)

Bryan Cantrill <bryan@...>
 


Chris,

I'm a little confused about the nomination process. In particular, I can't see where in the charter it describes who many nominate candidates for the TOC. In section 6(e)(ii) it says:

Each individual (entity or member) eligible to nominate a TOC member may nominate up to two (2) technical representatives, (from vendors, end users or any other fields), at most one of which may be from their respective company. The nominee(s) must agree to participate prior to being added to the nomination list.

But I cannot see where in the doc it is actually defines who is eligible to nominate a TOC member.  (Our implementation is that it is voting members of the governing board who are permitted to nominate, but why wouldn't the charter say that if that's the intent?)  I am trying to recall our chartering discussions, and I seem to recall that one of the advantages of any level of membership was that a member could nominate for the TOC; is that incorrect?  If so, would you mind pointing me to the document that defines the nomination process?

Somewhat similarly: I think it will also be helpful to get clarity about the origins of each member, to clearly delineate the 6 GB-determined members from the 2 TOC-determined members from the 1 end user-determined member.  Which is really a polite way of me saying that between the initial TOC conditions, the resignations, etc., I have lost track of who's who. ;)

          - Bryan


On Fri, Oct 26, 2018 at 2:32 PM Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...> wrote:
TOC nominations are starting TODAY for the 6 TOC slots that open up in Jan 2019 that are selected by GB members (they can propose UP TO TWO NOMINEES as part of the GB, where you can only nominate up to one candidate from your organization, the other candidate has to be outside your organization): https://github.com/cncf/toc/blob/master/process/election-schedule.md

The seats that open up are:

Jonathan Boulle (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Bryan Cantrill (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Camille Fournier (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Benjamin Hindman (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Ken Owens (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Alexis Richardson (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)

Here's the timeline for the election, we are giving ample time due to the holidays:

Oct 26th: Nominations Open (TODAY)
Nov 26th: Nominations Close
Nov 27th: Qualification Period Opens
Dec 14th: Qualification Period Closes (end of KubeCon Seattle)
Dec 17th: Election Opens
Jan 22nd: Election Closes
Jan 29th: Election Results Posted!

In summary, these nominations are for the 6 slots nominated by the CNCF Governing Board (GB) members. You have to be a CNCF GB member in order to nominate someone. Each CNCF GB member CAN NOMINATION ONLY TWO PEOPLE MAXIMUM, where only one of them can come from your company (the other candidate can come from anywhere). See CNCF Charter Section 6(e) for full election process details: https://www.cncf.io/about/charter

We will also discuss this at the next TOC meeting on Nov 6th regarding the process if the community has any questions.

Thanks!

--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


RFC: Archiving Project Process for CNCF

Chris Aniszczyk
 

TOC and wider community, there's been some discussion with the TOC about formalizing an archiving process for CNCF projects and what that would mean for projects.

Please take a look at this issue and associated PR and make some comments:

We would love to get feedback from the community on this topic. Thanks!

--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


RFC: Upcoming CNCF Project Graduation/Incubation Reviews

Chris Aniszczyk
 

Hey TOC and wider community, we have a set of project graduation/incubation reviews coming up that we want to share with the wider community:

containerd (graduation): https://github.com/cncf/toc/pull/165

Feel free to comment on the PRs, we will discuss many of these at the next TOC meeting.

Thanks!

--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


FYI: TOC Election (Jan 2019)

Chris Aniszczyk
 

TOC nominations are starting TODAY for the 6 TOC slots that open up in Jan 2019 that are selected by GB members (they can propose UP TO TWO NOMINEES as part of the GB, where you can only nominate up to one candidate from your organization, the other candidate has to be outside your organization): https://github.com/cncf/toc/blob/master/process/election-schedule.md

The seats that open up are:

Jonathan Boulle (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Bryan Cantrill (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Camille Fournier (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Benjamin Hindman (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Ken Owens (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)
Alexis Richardson (term: 3 years - start date: 1/29/2016)

Here's the timeline for the election, we are giving ample time due to the holidays:

Oct 26th: Nominations Open (TODAY)
Nov 26th: Nominations Close
Nov 27th: Qualification Period Opens
Dec 14th: Qualification Period Closes (end of KubeCon Seattle)
Dec 17th: Election Opens
Jan 22nd: Election Closes
Jan 29th: Election Results Posted!

In summary, these nominations are for the 6 slots nominated by the CNCF Governing Board (GB) members. You have to be a CNCF GB member in order to nominate someone. Each CNCF GB member CAN NOMINATION ONLY TWO PEOPLE MAXIMUM, where only one of them can come from your company (the other candidate can come from anywhere). See CNCF Charter Section 6(e) for full election process details: https://www.cncf.io/about/charter

We will also discuss this at the next TOC meeting on Nov 6th regarding the process if the community has any questions.

Thanks!

--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


Re: BoF scheduled on how to improve events at KubeCon Seattle

Richard Hartmann
 

Thank you for this. I kept making more and more notes, but could not
figure out a sane place to put a concise reply in this 100+ mail
thread.
On Thu, Oct 25, 2018 at 8:12 PM Chris Aniszczyk
<caniszczyk@...> wrote:

After some community feedback we scheduled this session at KubeCon Seattle:

"BoF: KubeCon + CloudNativeCon - How Can We Improve the Conference"
https://kccna18.sched.com/event/I7Iv

If you have more feedback, please comment on this doc:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1sDXfk5MHAmHZVdIx1t4PREo_SSXKcloCOUYjZIo4jBs/edit

Look forward to seeing folks in Seattle!

--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


Re: BoF scheduled on how to improve events at KubeCon Seattle

Chris Aniszczyk
 

It will run off the feedback doc + whatever suggestions people will bring up at the event.


On Thu, Oct 25, 2018 at 1:23 PM Ruben Orduz <ruben@...> wrote:
Really appreciate this. Unfortunately I need to leave Seattle before then. Will there be a separate agenda or doc or will it run off the feedback doc? 

Best,
Ruben

On Thu, Oct 25, 2018 at 2:12 PM Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...> wrote:
After some community feedback we scheduled this session at KubeCon Seattle:

"BoF: KubeCon + CloudNativeCon - How Can We Improve the Conference"

If you have more feedback, please comment on this doc:

Look forward to seeing folks in Seattle!

--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719



--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


Re: BoF scheduled on how to improve events at KubeCon Seattle

Ruben Orduz <ruben@...>
 

Really appreciate this. Unfortunately I need to leave Seattle before then. Will there be a separate agenda or doc or will it run off the feedback doc? 

Best,
Ruben

On Thu, Oct 25, 2018 at 2:12 PM Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...> wrote:
After some community feedback we scheduled this session at KubeCon Seattle:

"BoF: KubeCon + CloudNativeCon - How Can We Improve the Conference"

If you have more feedback, please comment on this doc:

Look forward to seeing folks in Seattle!

--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


BoF scheduled on how to improve events at KubeCon Seattle

Chris Aniszczyk
 

After some community feedback we scheduled this session at KubeCon Seattle:

"BoF: KubeCon + CloudNativeCon - How Can We Improve the Conference"

If you have more feedback, please comment on this doc:

Look forward to seeing folks in Seattle!

--
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719


Re: Discuss CloudNaticeCon/KubeCon technical content at the TOC

Doug Davis <dug@...>
 

Not sure I can make the next meeting, but my thoughts on some of these:

> Should only CNCF projects (direct CNCF projects and Kubernetes SIGs/
> sub-projects) have intros and deep dives on the maintainers track? A
> non-CNCF project has an intro and deep dive this time around.


Yes. If a non-CNCF project can get intro and deep-dive sessions then it
lessens the need to be a CNCF project - and I think waters down our branding.
How will we decide which non-CNCF projects to allow to use of "valuable"
rooms and time-slots that could go to more breakout sessions of CNCF
projects?

> Do we limit number of general sessions per vendor? This came up on
> the list because a vendor can currently have an outsized presence.
> This can lead to competing vendors, including those at the same
> sponsorship levels, feeling they are subsidizing their competition.


I think if we adopt some of the "blind" CFP reviews that's been discussed
then we shouldn't need to enforce these kinds of limits. If one company
dominates then its due to the content of their CFPs - and therefore they
deserve it (hopefully). I think that trying to limit on a per company basis
(while it might feel good to some) will just encourage game playing in the CFP
process - e.g. put some other company as lead presenter (if we even have that
concept) due to who submitted the CFP.  Or put another way - let's do the
"blind" CFP reviews first to see how that plays out, and if we're still not
happy with results then we can explore the next "baby step" which might be
to limit sessions per vendor. I'd just prefer to take it slow and not swing
the pendulum too far too quickly on this one.

-Doug


Re: Discuss CloudNaticeCon/KubeCon technical content at the TOC

Matt Farina
 

Sarah, thanks for calling out the negative language. I didn’t mean to go that route. Sorry about that.

I think like most things in this broader community we do better by focusing on improving outcomes for our target audience(s)  or segmenting them if they are incompatible (which I don't think they are) than by restricting things we don't like.  

I agree with Sarah on this.

Do we have our target audiences documented?

Not communicating target audiences and outcomes can cause problems. For example, on the KubeCon thoughts thread there was discussing comparing a serverless conference to the upcoming seattle serverless track where knative has 4 of the 6 slots. I’m not sure what the other serverless conference was but when I went digging the ones I found were focused on developers and app people. knative is not really targeted at app devs, or so I’ve been told, and instead the developers might use something like riff instead. Riff builds on knative. Was our serverless track targeted at a different audience going for a different outcome?

Maybe there wasn’t that much intention put into it. I just wanted to highlight how different audiences and different outcomes in the same space can happen.

It may be worth being explicit on target audiences and outcomes rather than leaving it up to our differing assumptions.

It might also help us highlight gaps we have as well as areas that are currently strong and worth praising.

-- 
Matt Farina
mattfarina.com



On Oct 22, 2018, at 12:38 PM, Sarah Novotny <sarahnovotny@...> wrote:

There are a few things in this discussion that are a serious concern for me.... 

vendor is being used as a pejorative here.  when we talk about vendors having outsized presences, there are also several who have very outsized *contributions* in the community (through code, docs, organizing and even full project donation).  

another concern for me is that the metrics quoted from the attendee survey was reframed from 35% of attendees listed attending sessions as their "top reason for attending" to "only a 1/3 attended for the general session technical content?"  That's not what was surveyed.  Top reason is very different from the reframe.  A conference which has ~30% expert (and speaker) attendees 30% intermediate (deeping their experience) attendees and 30% newbie attendees might well have only 30% of the attendees report session content as their *top* reason to attend the event and still be very healthy.

I do not disagree that having more user content is extraordinarily important.  However, if we want to also make the event relevant and engaging to a broad audience we have to accept that there are many reasons to attend an event such as this including collaboration with a peer group.

I think like most things in this broader community we do better by focusing on improving outcomes for our target audience(s)  or segmenting them if they are incompatible (which I don't think they are) than by restricting things we don't like.  

sarah

On Mon, Oct 22, 2018 at 9:08 AM alexis richardson <alexis@...> wrote:
It may be better to serve the community needs through smaller events.

On Mon, 22 Oct 2018, 16:44 Ruben Orduz, <ruben@...> wrote:
It is low. And the fact that "Networking" ranks higher, in my possibly wrong opinion, would lead me to think it's because the vendor-centric character of KubeCon. In community-driven confs which are much more geared toward individual end-users, the hallway/expo halls are ghost towns while the sessions are going. At KubeCon much like OpenStack summits the "hallway track" and expo hall were always bustling -- both share a vendor-centric focus.

Best,
Ruben

On Mon, Oct 22, 2018 at 11:22 AM Matt Farina <matt@...> wrote:
The top two reasons that people attended KubeCon + CloudNativeCon were for networking (40%) and to attend breakout sessions (35%)

Only about 1/3 of people attended for the general session technical content? Do we know if that has changed over time? Is this typical compared to other conferences?

I can’t help but wonder, am I wrong in thinking that number is low?

What does it say about the Con if more people are coming to network than lean from the content? What does that mean for vendors?

The information leads me to many questions. Anyone looking into this kind of stuff?

-- 
Matt Farina
mattfarina.com



On Oct 22, 2018, at 11:13 AM, Chris Aniszczyk <caniszczyk@...> wrote:

Thanks Matt, I will defer to Alexis as TOC Chair if he wants to make this an agenda item or not at an upcoming meeting. We are happy to offer space at KubeCon Seattle to discuss this topic with staff + TOC if you like in an F2F fashion if that's a better way to do this.

Just a reminder: we have collected feedback from the last discussion on the mailing list and have collated it here: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1sDXfk5MHAmHZVdIx1t4PREo_SSXKcloCOUYjZIo4jBs/edit (encourage comments from the community to build on this doc)

re: Yuri's point, yes we survey after every event, I've attached the report from last KubeCon in Copenhagen. "Feedback from attendees was overwhelmingly positive, with an overall average rating of 4.5 / 5. The top two reasons that people attended KubeCon + CloudNativeCon were for networking (40%) and to attend breakout sessions (35%)"

On Mon, Oct 22, 2018 at 4:02 PM Yuri Shkuro <shkuro@...> wrote:
Has there been a survey of attendees from previous conferences? Is there data that shows attendees dissatisfaction with the content and specific areas?

On Mon, Oct 22, 2018 at 10:53 AM Matt Farina <matt@...> wrote:
I would like to request that we have a discussion in a TOC meeting on the Con technical content. I’m happy to help curate items to discuss on it.

Three ideas I would initially seed the list with are:

  • Should only CNCF projects (direct CNCF projects and Kubernetes SIGs/sub-projects) have intros and deep dives on the maintainers track? A non-CNCF project has an intro and deep dive this time around.
  • Should we look to target tracks around types of user roles (e.g., app dev, app ops, cluster ops, project maintainers, management decision makers, etc)? If these kinds of users want to be there it gives vendors a good reason to have booths there, along with being useful to end users. I believe some of these roles are underserved today.
  • Do we limit number of general sessions per vendor? This came up on the list because a vendor can currently have an outsized presence. This can lead to competing vendors, including those at the same sponsorship levels, feeling they are subsidizing their competition.

These are just questions to talk about. Maybe ideas. Anyone have others?

I would ask that we keep these to constructive ideas to improve future Cons so we have help what comes next.


-- 
Matt Farina
mattfarina.com







-- 
Chris Aniszczyk (@cra) | +1-512-961-6719
<KC_CNC_EU18_Report_Final-compressed.pdf>




4601 - 4620 of 7186