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Re: [VOTE] Linkerd for Graduation

Dave Zolotusky
 

+1 binding

On Mon, Jul 12, 2021 at 8:15 PM Amye Scavarda Perrin <ascavarda@...> wrote:
Linkerd has applied to move from Incubating to Graduated.

PR: https://github.com/cncf/toc/pull/616
Due Diligence (DD) doc: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1-b9jS1v6uc26y6SySt_JG0eVkFU5gKiYeXfqiGVqPPs

Dave Zolotusky is the  TOC sponsor for Linkerd, has called for public comment and has approved a call for public vote. (https://lists.cncf.io/g/cncf-toc/message/5917)

Please vote (+1/0/-1) by replying to this thread.

Remember that the TOC has binding votes only, but we do appreciate non-binding votes from the community as a sign of support!


--
Amye Scavarda Perrin | Program Manager | amye@...

--
~Dave
[VOTE] KEDA for Incubation

Amye Scavarda Perrin
 

The KEDA project has applied for Incubation status.

PR: https://github.com/cncf/toc/pull/622

Due Diligence: https://docs.google.com/document/d/16iqSoPiOe7N0jNevuXvan31ut3MocGLz-I9yTLGaSdM/edit

Liz Rice is the TOC Sponsor for this project, has called for public comment and has approved a call for a public vote. https://lists.cncf.io/g/cncf-toc/message/5918

Please vote (+1/0/-1) by replying to this thread.

Remember that the TOC has binding votes only, but we do appreciate non-binding votes from the community as a sign of support!

--
Amye Scavarda Perrin | Program Manager | amye@...
[VOTE] Linkerd for Graduation

Amye Scavarda Perrin
 

Linkerd has applied to move from Incubating to Graduated.

PR: https://github.com/cncf/toc/pull/616
Due Diligence (DD) doc: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1-b9jS1v6uc26y6SySt_JG0eVkFU5gKiYeXfqiGVqPPs

Dave Zolotusky is the  TOC sponsor for Linkerd, has called for public comment and has approved a call for public vote. (https://lists.cncf.io/g/cncf-toc/message/5917)

Please vote (+1/0/-1) by replying to this thread.

Remember that the TOC has binding votes only, but we do appreciate non-binding votes from the community as a sign of support!

--
Amye Scavarda Perrin | Program Manager | amye@...
Crossplane 2021 annual review

Jared Watts <jared@...>
 

Hello TOC and all -

We have opened a PR containing the annual review content for Crossplane: https://github.com/cncf/toc/pull/689

We are quite far along with our Incubation proposal, but wanted to be thorough and cover this annual review as well while that is ongoing.

Let us know if there are any comments or questions :)

- jared
Re: [VOTE] OpenMetrics for Incubation

Hausenblas, Michael
 

+1 non-binding
Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [cncf-toc] [VOTE] OpenTelemetry for incubation

Paul Buck
 


+1 non-binding

... Paul



On Thu, Jul 8, 2021 at 4:20 PM Ken Haines via lists.cncf.io <Kenneth.Haines=microsoft.com@...> wrote:
+1 NB

Cheers,

Ken

From: cncf-toc@... <cncf-toc@...> on behalf of Liz Rice via lists.cncf.io <liz=lizrice.com@...>
Sent: Wednesday, July 7, 2021 1:36 AM
To: cncf-toc@... <cncf-toc@...>
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [cncf-toc] [VOTE] OpenTelemetry for incubation
 
+1 binding 

Regarding the communication of different levels of maturity of different parts of the project, the status page is a good addition, thank you!



On Wed, Jul 7, 2021 at 8:50 AM Bing Lien via lists.cncf.io <binglien=hitrust.com.tw@...> wrote:
+1 nb

從我的iPhone傳送
Re: [EXTERNAL] [cncf-toc] [VOTE] OpenMetrics for Incubation

Ken Haines <Kenneth.Haines@...>
 

+1 NB

Cheers,

Ken

From: cncf-toc@... <cncf-toc@...> on behalf of Amye Scavarda Perrin via lists.cncf.io <ascavarda=linuxfoundation.org@...>
Sent: Wednesday, July 7, 2021 12:01 PM
To: CNCF TOC <cncf-toc@...>
Subject: [EXTERNAL] [cncf-toc] [VOTE] OpenMetrics for Incubation
 
OpenMetrics has applied to move from Sandbox to Incubation.

PR: https://github.com/cncf/toc/pull/615
Due Diligence (DD) doc: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1BN6ABvfbAMhJthH6xNOY5Lmls3jeE3kFbMgF04BzEKE/edit#heading=h.jidcx4f4xk02


Alena Prokharchyk has called for public comment (https://lists.cncf.io/g/cncf-toc/message/5913) and has approved a call for a public vote.
 
Please vote (+1/0/-1) by replying to this thread.

Remember that the TOC has binding votes only, but we do appreciate non-binding votes from the community as a sign of support!

--
Amye Scavarda Perrin | Program Manager | amye@...
Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [cncf-toc] [VOTE] OpenTelemetry for incubation

Ken Haines <Kenneth.Haines@...>
 

+1 NB

Cheers,

Ken

From: cncf-toc@... <cncf-toc@...> on behalf of Liz Rice via lists.cncf.io <liz=lizrice.com@...>
Sent: Wednesday, July 7, 2021 1:36 AM
To: cncf-toc@... <cncf-toc@...>
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [cncf-toc] [VOTE] OpenTelemetry for incubation
 
+1 binding 

Regarding the communication of different levels of maturity of different parts of the project, the status page is a good addition, thank you!



On Wed, Jul 7, 2021 at 8:50 AM Bing Lien via lists.cncf.io <binglien=hitrust.com.tw@...> wrote:
+1 nb

從我的iPhone傳送
Re: [VOTE] OpenTelemetry for incubation

KRV <Venkatraman.R@...>
 

+1 binding

 

 

Best Regards,

Venkat | +91 9148984211

Desk     | +91 80 410 57045

Lack Of Planning On Your Part,

Does not Constitute An Emergency On Mine.

 

 

 

From: cncf-toc@... <cncf-toc@...> On Behalf Of Dave Zolotusky via lists.cncf.io
Sent: Thursday, July 8, 2021 11:48 AM
To: Dennis Kieselhorst <deki@...>
Cc: CNCF TOC <cncf-toc@...>
Subject: Re: [cncf-toc] [VOTE] OpenTelemetry for incubation

 

[**EXTERNAL EMAIL**]

+1 binding

 

On Thu, Jul 8, 2021 at 7:06 AM Dennis Kieselhorst <deki@...> wrote:

+1 non-binding


 

--

~Dave
Re: [VOTE] OpenMetrics for Incubation

Eduardo Silva
 

+1 non-binding!

On Thu, 8 Jul 2021 at 04:14, Rob Skillington <rob@...> wrote:
+1 non-binding!

On Wed, Jul 7, 2021 at 7:05 PM Alena Prokharchyk via lists.cncf.io <aprokharchyk=apple.com@...> wrote:
Hi Mark,

Thank you for raising this question. There are no plans to merge OpenTelemetry and OpenMetrics. There is an effort by OpenTelemetry on adding OpenMetrics support to the collector. Together with the Prometheus and OpenMetrics community, the workgroup was formed, with weekly meetings that move this work forward. Many non-trivial challenges are being discussed and worked on, which brings benefits to all communities. More information and meetings notes can be found here https://github.com/open-telemetry/wg-prometheus, everybody is welcome to participate and ask questions.

-alena

On Jul 7, 2021, at 2:11 PM, Mark Carter <markcartertm@...> wrote:

I am supportive of Openmetrics, but would like to raise a concern.

I am hearing more and more customers who are confused with how Opentelemetry metrics and Openmetrics relate to each other and which one they should be implementing. 
I am concerned that without a plan for CNCF to collapse Openmetrics and Opentelemetry metrics specs to a single spec we may end up in a similar situation to when we had Opentracing and Opencensus as parallel projects which each had a slightly different view on tracing.
Would be great to have guidance to customers on what is CNCF view on the relationship between the two and whether they should or should not merge and why.

Would love to understand how others in the community and TOC view this as I may not have the full picture.

Thank you for your insights,
Mark


On Wed, Jul 7, 2021 at 1:22 PM Alena Prokharchyk via lists.cncf.io <aprokharchyk=apple.com@...> wrote:
+1 binding

-alena

On Jul 7, 2021, at 12:01 PM, Amye Scavarda Perrin <ascavarda@...> wrote:

OpenMetrics has applied to move from Sandbox to Incubation.

PR: https://github.com/cncf/toc/pull/615
Due Diligence (DD) doc: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1BN6ABvfbAMhJthH6xNOY5Lmls3jeE3kFbMgF04BzEKE/edit#heading=h.jidcx4f4xk02


Alena Prokharchyk has called for public comment (https://lists.cncf.io/g/cncf-toc/message/5913) and has approved a call for a public vote.
 
Please vote (+1/0/-1) by replying to this thread.

Remember that the TOC has binding votes only, but we do appreciate non-binding votes from the community as a sign of support!

-- 
Amye Scavarda Perrin | Program Manager | amye@...




--

Re: [VOTE] OpenMetrics for Incubation

Rob Skillington
 

+1 non-binding!

On Wed, Jul 7, 2021 at 7:05 PM Alena Prokharchyk via lists.cncf.io <aprokharchyk=apple.com@...> wrote:
Hi Mark,

Thank you for raising this question. There are no plans to merge OpenTelemetry and OpenMetrics. There is an effort by OpenTelemetry on adding OpenMetrics support to the collector. Together with the Prometheus and OpenMetrics community, the workgroup was formed, with weekly meetings that move this work forward. Many non-trivial challenges are being discussed and worked on, which brings benefits to all communities. More information and meetings notes can be found here https://github.com/open-telemetry/wg-prometheus, everybody is welcome to participate and ask questions.

-alena

On Jul 7, 2021, at 2:11 PM, Mark Carter <markcartertm@...> wrote:

I am supportive of Openmetrics, but would like to raise a concern.

I am hearing more and more customers who are confused with how Opentelemetry metrics and Openmetrics relate to each other and which one they should be implementing. 
I am concerned that without a plan for CNCF to collapse Openmetrics and Opentelemetry metrics specs to a single spec we may end up in a similar situation to when we had Opentracing and Opencensus as parallel projects which each had a slightly different view on tracing.
Would be great to have guidance to customers on what is CNCF view on the relationship between the two and whether they should or should not merge and why.

Would love to understand how others in the community and TOC view this as I may not have the full picture.

Thank you for your insights,
Mark


On Wed, Jul 7, 2021 at 1:22 PM Alena Prokharchyk via lists.cncf.io <aprokharchyk=apple.com@...> wrote:
+1 binding

-alena

On Jul 7, 2021, at 12:01 PM, Amye Scavarda Perrin <ascavarda@...> wrote:

OpenMetrics has applied to move from Sandbox to Incubation.

PR: https://github.com/cncf/toc/pull/615
Due Diligence (DD) doc: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1BN6ABvfbAMhJthH6xNOY5Lmls3jeE3kFbMgF04BzEKE/edit#heading=h.jidcx4f4xk02


Alena Prokharchyk has called for public comment (https://lists.cncf.io/g/cncf-toc/message/5913) and has approved a call for a public vote.
 
Please vote (+1/0/-1) by replying to this thread.

Remember that the TOC has binding votes only, but we do appreciate non-binding votes from the community as a sign of support!

-- 
Amye Scavarda Perrin | Program Manager | amye@...
Re: [VOTE] OpenTelemetry for incubation

Dave Zolotusky
 

+1 binding

On Thu, Jul 8, 2021 at 7:06 AM Dennis Kieselhorst <deki@...> wrote:
+1 non-binding



--
~Dave
Re: [VOTE] OpenTelemetry for incubation

Dennis Kieselhorst
 

+1 non-binding
Re: [VOTE] OpenTelemetry for incubation

Mark Carter
 

Perhaps as a counterpoint, I am aware of several hundred customers using OpenTelemetry in production.
With OTEL tracing already heavily used and metrics expected to hit GA by the end of the year I personally feel thatOpentelemetry is what we would expect of an incubating project to be.
My $0.02,
Mark


Sent from my mobile phone 

On Jul 7, 2021, at 11:21 AM, Eduardo Silva <eduardo@...> wrote:


Hi Alena, 

My primary concerns are Metrics and Logs, I was asked by a couple of techs leads about my opinion and I am pretty much sharing the same.

For an incubation project, maturity and adoption are required, I know that first hand by our experience with the Fluentd project.  As you mention some areas are being prioritized to fill the gaps, which is great, but now when doing a "checkpoint evaluation" I simply think is not yet ready, the question is: is it ready for incubation now, or will be ready later ?.  

Definitely moving a project from Sandbox -> Incubation helps in many areas such as marketing and adoption, but we don't aim to be a blocker on that, adoption must be organic.

As a bit of context, at Fluentd we are integrating metrics too as part of our processing and forwarding pipeline, and our evaluation ended up with: we have to integrate with Prometheus ecosystem first (open metrics) because Opentelemetry is not yet ready. So how can we tell the end-users that this project is incubating by solving A, B, C but only A is ready? I know this is a complex topic.  If Otel moves to incubation today, for us (Fluentd) the maturity and specs will be the same, we will take the same decision to wait for some more maturity, so it's not ready.

I am not against Opentelemetry, all the opposite, I want Opentelemetry to succeed (we will natively integrate with it!) and I think providing more time to mature Metrics and Logs is highly beneficial, but rushing it to increase adoption and vendors awareness is not. 

I am pretty sure Opentelemetry might get the votes to move forward anyway, but this is my technical opinion based on experience as a maintainer and being around on CNCF for some time. 

Simply, there is nothing wrong to be in Sandbox a bit more time to get more maturity... 

best, 


On Wed, 7 Jul 2021 at 11:25, Alena Prokharchyk <aprokharchyk@...> wrote:
Eduardo,

Thank you for advocating on behalf of end-users. 

Keeping focus on end-user adoption, experience, and ensuring that components maturity is communicated to the users transparently (http://opentelemetry.io/status/ ), was an essential part of OpenTelemetry Due Diligence. OpenTelemetry is widely adopted by end-user companies at scale, and interviewing them as part of the process was insightful. One of the common requests was to clarify OpenTracing place. OpenTracing is CNCF Incubating project, but it's being merged to OpenTelemtry which exists at Sandbox level. As a part of OpenTelemetry incubation, OpenTracing will be archived from CNCF; here is the deprecation plan: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1WgSQ7ZvzO-JHeZi_ECRC7dwIbJYHPoYSXJqS1hLDJgI/edit# . Another common question was around integration with OpenMetrics, and it is already being prioritized by OpenTelemetry team. Together with the Prometheus and OpenMetrics community, the workgroup was formed, with weekly meetings that move this work forward.

It is true that not all the signals are not GA at this point. And it's common for projects to have experimental features. Given OpenTelemetry scope, getting the remaining current features to GA will take some community effort. OpenTelemetry already has an inclusive governing model and diverse committers base. Project moving to Incubation will help with the community growth, existing features hardening and new features/integrations development.

-alena

On Jul 6, 2021, at 3:23 PM, Eduardo Silva <eduardo@...> wrote:

-1 non-binding
Disclaimer: I like OTel project and even in Fluent ecosystem we are working towards integration with it.
My reasons might be controversial but I think OTel is not ready for incubation "yet".
As an end-user and project maintainer, I care about usability. OTel aims to cover Traces, Metrics, and Logs:
  • At this point, only Traces are in GA state. Usable.
  • Metrics: API and SDKs are "DRAFT" and the collector is experimental. Per my understanding, there is no stable integration with openmetrics or Prometheus ecosystem (for me and "many companies" this is a must). Partial usable.
  • Logs: API and SDKs are "DRAFT", the collector is experimental. Not usable.
A project at the incubation stage has to demonstrate maturity and wide adoption, if this is not the case as a foundation (CNCF) we might be sending the wrong message to the end users.
We aim to incubate projects with enough maturity and a minimal level of usability, but this is not the case. This is nothing against OTel but a purely technical opinion. I know we cannot incubate a sub-set of it like Traces only, but this is a complete offering and there are missing pieces of integration and implementation.
I think moving OTel to incubation might help cloud vendors to spread the message, but what about the end users?
The formal doc states:
"TOC acknowledged the gaps in stability and adoption of significant Logging and Metric parts of the OpenTelemetry project. TOC confirmed it should not be a blocker for incubation. "
I disagree, I think this is a blocker, there is so much pressure from vendors..., and rushing things might not be beneficial for the long term.
Why not wait a bit more and do a proper incubation with the minimal pieces on it? I think staying in Sandbox a bit more will be beneficial for the project while rushing it might hurt the ecosystem.

On Tue, 6 Jul 2021 at 15:48, Bob Killen <killen.bob@...> wrote:
+1 non-binding.
\o/


On Tue, Jul 6, 2021 at 3:31 PM Amye Scavarda Perrin <ascavarda@...> wrote:
OpenTelemetry has applied to move from Sandbox to Incubation.

PR: https://github.com/cncf/toc/pull/619
Due Diligence (DD) doc: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1f4WQR6K84giyOCKjCsqcoVA8YUIzBhWZDVo3CwM1wuk/edit 

Alena Prokharchyk has called for public comment (https://lists.cncf.io/g/cncf-toc/message/5914) and has approved a call for a public vote.
  
Please vote (+1/0/-1) by replying to this thread.

Remember that the TOC has binding votes only, but we do appreciate non-binding votes from the community as a sign of support!

-- 
Amye Scavarda Perrin | Program Manager | amye@...






-- 



--

Re: [VOTE] OpenMetrics for Incubation

Alena Prokharchyk
 

Hi Mark,

Thank you for raising this question. There are no plans to merge OpenTelemetry and OpenMetrics. There is an effort by OpenTelemetry on adding OpenMetrics support to the collector. Together with the Prometheus and OpenMetrics community, the workgroup was formed, with weekly meetings that move this work forward. Many non-trivial challenges are being discussed and worked on, which brings benefits to all communities. More information and meetings notes can be found here https://github.com/open-telemetry/wg-prometheus, everybody is welcome to participate and ask questions.

-alena

On Jul 7, 2021, at 2:11 PM, Mark Carter <markcartertm@...> wrote:

I am supportive of Openmetrics, but would like to raise a concern.

I am hearing more and more customers who are confused with how Opentelemetry metrics and Openmetrics relate to each other and which one they should be implementing. 
I am concerned that without a plan for CNCF to collapse Openmetrics and Opentelemetry metrics specs to a single spec we may end up in a similar situation to when we had Opentracing and Opencensus as parallel projects which each had a slightly different view on tracing.
Would be great to have guidance to customers on what is CNCF view on the relationship between the two and whether they should or should not merge and why.

Would love to understand how others in the community and TOC view this as I may not have the full picture.

Thank you for your insights,
Mark


On Wed, Jul 7, 2021 at 1:22 PM Alena Prokharchyk via lists.cncf.io <aprokharchyk=apple.com@...> wrote:
+1 binding

-alena

On Jul 7, 2021, at 12:01 PM, Amye Scavarda Perrin <ascavarda@...> wrote:

OpenMetrics has applied to move from Sandbox to Incubation.

PR: https://github.com/cncf/toc/pull/615
Due Diligence (DD) doc: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1BN6ABvfbAMhJthH6xNOY5Lmls3jeE3kFbMgF04BzEKE/edit#heading=h.jidcx4f4xk02


Alena Prokharchyk has called for public comment (https://lists.cncf.io/g/cncf-toc/message/5913) and has approved a call for a public vote.
 
Please vote (+1/0/-1) by replying to this thread.

Remember that the TOC has binding votes only, but we do appreciate non-binding votes from the community as a sign of support!

-- 
Amye Scavarda Perrin | Program Manager | amye@...
Re: [VOTE] OpenMetrics for Incubation

Mark Carter
 

I am supportive of Openmetrics, but would like to raise a concern.

I am hearing more and more customers who are confused with how Opentelemetry metrics and Openmetrics relate to each other and which one they should be implementing. 
I am concerned that without a plan for CNCF to collapse Openmetrics and Opentelemetry metrics specs to a single spec we may end up in a similar situation to when we had Opentracing and Opencensus as parallel projects which each had a slightly different view on tracing.
Would be great to have guidance to customers on what is CNCF view on the relationship between the two and whether they should or should not merge and why.

Would love to understand how others in the community and TOC view this as I may not have the full picture.

Thank you for your insights,
Mark


On Wed, Jul 7, 2021 at 1:22 PM Alena Prokharchyk via lists.cncf.io <aprokharchyk=apple.com@...> wrote:
+1 binding

-alena

On Jul 7, 2021, at 12:01 PM, Amye Scavarda Perrin <ascavarda@...> wrote:

OpenMetrics has applied to move from Sandbox to Incubation.

PR: https://github.com/cncf/toc/pull/615
Due Diligence (DD) doc: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1BN6ABvfbAMhJthH6xNOY5Lmls3jeE3kFbMgF04BzEKE/edit#heading=h.jidcx4f4xk02


Alena Prokharchyk has called for public comment (https://lists.cncf.io/g/cncf-toc/message/5913) and has approved a call for a public vote.
 
Please vote (+1/0/-1) by replying to this thread.

Remember that the TOC has binding votes only, but we do appreciate non-binding votes from the community as a sign of support!

--
Amye Scavarda Perrin | Program Manager | amye@...
Re: [VOTE] OpenMetrics for Incubation

Alena Prokharchyk
 

+1 binding

-alena

On Jul 7, 2021, at 12:01 PM, Amye Scavarda Perrin <ascavarda@...> wrote:

OpenMetrics has applied to move from Sandbox to Incubation.

PR: https://github.com/cncf/toc/pull/615
Due Diligence (DD) doc: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1BN6ABvfbAMhJthH6xNOY5Lmls3jeE3kFbMgF04BzEKE/edit#heading=h.jidcx4f4xk02


Alena Prokharchyk has called for public comment (https://lists.cncf.io/g/cncf-toc/message/5913) and has approved a call for a public vote.
 
Please vote (+1/0/-1) by replying to this thread.

Remember that the TOC has binding votes only, but we do appreciate non-binding votes from the community as a sign of support!

--
Amye Scavarda Perrin | Program Manager | amye@...
Re: [VOTE] OpenMetrics for Incubation

Brian Brazil
 

+1 non-binding
Re: [VOTE] OpenMetrics for Incubation

Richard Hartmann
 

+1 non-binding
[VOTE] OpenMetrics for Incubation

Amye Scavarda Perrin
 

OpenMetrics has applied to move from Sandbox to Incubation.

PR: https://github.com/cncf/toc/pull/615
Due Diligence (DD) doc: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1BN6ABvfbAMhJthH6xNOY5Lmls3jeE3kFbMgF04BzEKE/edit#heading=h.jidcx4f4xk02


Alena Prokharchyk has called for public comment (https://lists.cncf.io/g/cncf-toc/message/5913) and has approved a call for a public vote.
 
Please vote (+1/0/-1) by replying to this thread.

Remember that the TOC has binding votes only, but we do appreciate non-binding votes from the community as a sign of support!

--
Amye Scavarda Perrin | Program Manager | amye@...
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